Vvvv on MacOS :) (and Linux)

[benju]

I was recently looking into possible solutions for running vvvv on MacOS and want to bring this again on the feature agenda. We all know vvvv editor on other platforms is on the upcoming roadmap and the day will come ;)

I really also found this one Proton-like on MacOS especially interesing for the devs maybe?

However in the meantime, I might want to set up this thread to collect and exchange about running vvvv on MacOS and Linux with workarounds as virtual machines or emulators.

Other then getting a native editor per se, there are four ways:
1.) native dual boot
2.) using a virtual machine
3.) using an emulator
4.) using a translation layer

Here’s a comparison table of possibilities to run Windows applications on Mac/Linux I created during my research (obviously with the assistance of ChatGPT) and helped me to understand the tools:

Ways to Run Windows on macOS – Comparison

Feature	Native Dual Boot	Virtual Machine (VM)	Emulator (QEMU/UTM)	Translation Layer (Wine-based: Whiskey, Kegworks, CrossOver)
Available Software/Tools	Boot Camp (Intel only)	Parallels, VMware Fusion, VirtualBox, QEMU+UTM	QEMU+UTM (GUI front-end for QEMU)	Whiskey, Kegworks Winery, CrossOver
Downsides	Requires reboot, no macOS access while in Windows. Not supported on M1, M2, or later Macs. Needs enough space to install a second OS.	Uses system resources (RAM/CPU) for virtualization. Needs enough space for both macOS and the virtualized Windows OS.	Slow for x86 emulation on ARM (M1/M2 Macs). Not ideal for gaming or performance-heavy apps. Needs enough space for emulated Windows OS.	Not all apps work, known compatibility issues. Configuration may require tweaking.
Best For	Maximum performance, gaming, and apps needing full hardware access.	Running full Windows environments alongside macOS.	Running Windows on unsupported hardware (e.g., x86 Windows on an ARM Mac) or virtualizing ARM apps.	Running Windows apps without installing Windows, often used for games.
What It Does	Installs and runs Windows directly on Mac hardware.	Runs a full Windows OS inside macOS using virtualization.	Fully mimics (emulates) another computer’s hardware, or virtualizes OSes (e.g., x86 on ARM).	Translates Windows API calls to macOS equivalents.
Hardware Compatibility	❌ Intel Macs only	✅ Works on Intel & Apple Silicon (some tools limited)	✅ Works on Intel & Apple Silicon (UTM simplifies setup)	⚠️ Only supports some Windows apps, CrossOver focuses more on general apps, others focus on games.
Windows Required?	✅ Yes (full install)	✅ Yes (full install)	✅ Yes (full install)	❌ No, runs Windows apps directly
Software Compatibility	✅ Full Windows support	✅ Full Windows support	✅ Full Windows support (if emulated)	❌ Not all apps work, may have bugs, but supports many games.
Performance	✅ Best (full hardware access)	⚡ Fast (if using virtualization)	🐢 Slow for emulation (x86 on ARM), fast for virtualization	🚀 Fast (no OS emulation, just API translation, but may have stability issues).

Here are my experiences and collected 2nd hand observations so far:

Testing vvvv Gamma on macOS - Tool Comparison
Tool	Type of Tool	Test Results	Known Issues	Backlash/Limitations	Price	URL
Boot Camp	Dual Boot	Works like a charm	-	Not supported on M1, M2, M3, needs space for a full OS installation	Free with macOS	Boot Camp Assistant User Guide for Mac - Apple Support
Parallels Desktop	Virtualization Layer	Not personally tested yet, but heard from other users running it successfully, but also from complications.	Performance can vary depending on configuration	Subscription-based, needs space for a full OS install	Free trial, ca. 75€-120€/Year	Run Windows on Mac with a virtual machine | Parallels Desktop
UTM (QEMU)	Virtualization/Emulator	Saw it running on MacOS with performance issues	Performance issues, especially with UI elements (Menu, NodeBrowser, …)	needs space for a full OS installation	Free	https://mac.getutm.app/
CrossOver (Wine)	Compatibility Layer	Running but very unstable, however might be an option to look into it further with the devs of the tool? Also had an exportet App sucessfully running as well as various help patches (with Skia and Stride).	Requires some tweaking, very unstable, especially crahes always when using UI elements as menue, NodeBrowser, … Menu and toolbar does not show up on start.	Subscription-based	Free trial, ca. 74€ / 12 months, 484€ / Lifetime	https://www.codeweavers.com/
Whiskey (Wine)	Compatibility Layer	Tested without success so far with different settings	no sucess at all so far	-	Free	https://getwhisky.app/
Kegworks (Wine)	Compatibility Layer	Tested without success so far with different settings - evtl. needs some other Winetricks	no sucess at all so far	-	Free	GitHub - Kegworks-App/Kegworks: A user-friendly tool used to make wine wrapped ports of Windows software for macOS.

I’m curious to hear from your experiences. I’ll post some screenshots below from running vvvv with CrossOver which was the most promising looking into a fast translation layer solution without having to install a full VM and Win-OS. However all solutions ar not working out of the box so far for me.

[seltzdesign]

Thanks for resurrecting this topic. I too would love to run vvvv on MacOs in some way.

It would also be great to find a way to run at least compiled exe’s from vvvv on MacOS, which I might try with the Game Porting Toolkit by Apple.

I guess Stride and Fuse would be most of a challenge, since they would have to be made compatible with Metal. I can imagine this being quite a lot of work.

After I just got a used Macbook with M3 Pro I installed Parallels and Windows Arm. I installed vvvv, but it wouldn’t run. Maybe I didn’t use the right build of vvvv and I will try some more.

Happy to help with testing.

[benju]

As mentioned above, I found CrossOver quite promising when looking into a lightweight solution, however it was crashing constantly, but especially when using the editor in terms of opening the NodeBrowser, trying to use the Menu etc…

While only testing the help patches in the renderer window it was quite stable and however the performance looked surprisingly okay.

Here are some with Skia and Stride examples running smooth on a M1 MacBookPro. (13-inch, M1, 2020). Could not test Fuse as I could only open help patches and not install any nugets. I also tested it succesfully with one exported application (only ImGUI/Skia), so this would be also a possibility to test with CrossOver. Trial period is over now and I’m not sure how soon I might find time to look into it again - but I wanted to at least document my findings and hear about other experiences.

Here are some screenhots running vvvv gamm 6.7 on MacOS :
Processing: vvvv-on-macos_crossover_01.png…
Processing: vvvv-on-macos_crossover_02.png…
Processing: vvvv-on-macos_crossover_03.png…

Edit: For any reason image upload does not complete, in the meantime please find the screenshots here.

[bjoern]

@benju

however it was crashing constantly, but especially when using the editor in terms of opening the NodeBrowser, trying to use the Menu etc…

Have you also tried with newer previews? There was a change in january that improved stability under wine / linux:

https://teamcity.vvvv.org/change/87889?personal=false&tab=files

There are also these instructions to get T3 running under MacOS, should be similar for vvvv.

[readme]

Can’t contribute anything to this topic, but just sharing that I’m very interested in your findings as I need to buy a new laptop soon.

… and I’m a sucker for aesthetics and find most PC laptops kind of ugly, but didn’t look at a lot.
I would prefer a sleek macbook air m4 over any kind of mobile gpu, as I’m kind of happy with Parsec when I need more hardware power when I’m on my laptop only.

[seltzdesign]

@readme

I’m a sucker for aesthetics and find most PC laptops kind of ugly

not just ugly, but usually cheap materials, really shitty battery life and close to no support if anything goes wrong with them.

@readme

happy with Parsec

yeah, parsec is great. If only they had an iPad app since they already support touch if you have the Warp subscription. But I guess using an iPad with a Macbook using Sidecar should work. I’ll try that.

[dani21s]

@seltzdesign

After I just got a used Macbook with M3 Pro I installed Parallels and Windows Arm. I installed vvvv, but it wouldn’t run. Maybe I didn’t use the right build of vvvv and I will try some more

I had succes with VmWare Fusion with Windows 11 for Arm, but you have to manually install dotNet sdk for arm64 (the x64 version is also required, but it is downloaded automatically when you start gamma)
https://dotnet.microsoft.com/en-us/download/dotnet/thank-you/sdk-8.0.407-windows-arm64-installer

I think if you install the arm64 sdk you will be able to run gamma even with paralles.

[seltzdesign]

@dani21s

I think if you install the arm64 sdk you will be able to run gamma even with paralles.

Ah yes, you were totally right. It works! Opened a few help patches and most worked.

I opened one with Stride and got this error:

[dani21s]

I have never tried the preview version, only the stable version that works with skia and stride.

[benju]

@bjoern

Have you also tried with newer previews? There was a change in january that improved stability under wine / linux:

Log in to TeamCity — TeamCity

Unfortunately not. Also when looking at the Screenshots, you may realize that the whole menubar (quadmenu, docuement menu, patch-tabs) is missing. Would be interesting if it’s different with the 7.x previews. Unfortunately the CrossOver trial is over and I also don’t find the time at the moment to test further.

@bjoern

There are also these instructions to get T3 running under MacOS, should be similar for vvvv.

That looks indeed very promising as well. I now rememember I was also trying Kegworks, but did not succeed to run vvvv. I should also add it to the list above. Maybe I was missing some of the wintricks mentioned in the instructions for Tooll3, so it’s worth retrying.

Kegworks (A wrapper project that’s the successor to Wineskin): GitHub - Kegworks-App/Kegworks: A user-friendly tool used to make wine wrapped ports of Windows software for macOS.

The advantage would be not having to install a full second OS which is often a disk space issue.
But also great to hear it seems to run on VMs with the ARM Sdk.

How are your experiences in performance, stability and accessing in- and output devices?

[bjoern]

@readme

and I’m a sucker for aesthetics and find most PC laptops kind of ugly, but didn’t look at a lot.

Don’t want to derail the thread but did you check frame.work? :

• Framework | Choose Framework Laptop 16 (AMD Ryzen™ 7040 Series)
• https://www.notebookcheck.net/Radeon-RX-7700S-performance-debut-Framework-Laptop-16-review.790807.0.html

[bjoern]

@benju

How are your experiences in performance, stability and accessing in- and output devices?

Non-existent since I don’t own a Mac.

[benju]

@bjoern

Have you also tried with newer previews? There was a change in january that improved stability under wine / linux:

Log in to TeamCity — TeamCity

There are also these instructions to get T3 running under MacOS, should be similar for vvvv.

I tried the attempt to get vvvv gamma started with Kegworks Winery and the T3 instructions again. Tested the current 2025-7-0-282 versions (via full package, but also via Installer), unfortunately did not succeed to start it.

One problem might be that I don’t succeed installing the donet40 Winetricks and maybe other runtime libraries/dependencies might be missing.
From winetricks for donet40 I get the following error:

warning: dotnet40 install completed, but installed file /Users/XXX/Applications/Kegworks/vvvv.app/Contents/SharedSupport/prefix/dosdevices/c:/windows/Microsoft.NET/Framework/v4.0.30319/ngen.exe not found

I found some entries in kegworks forums and it seems to be a knwon issue, but I think it’s anyway not the only problem.

Is there maybe a list of all runtime libraries / dependencies which needs to be installed for vvvv gamma / which are usually installed during the installation process? didn’t find this information in the graybook.

Would I want to preferably get the vvvv gamma ARM-Version or the 64-bit version running?
When attempting to install the ARM-Version via the vvvv-installer within Kegworks, I get an error not running a compatible OS.

[benju]

At least also a small success to report: I managed to run a simple exported app with Skia and ImGui via Kegworks on macOS - definitely worth further exploration.

The downside: Even small vvvv apps integrated into a Kegworks .app for macOS will become quite large (>2GB-4GB) due to the necessary system implementations and additional runtimes. :/

[bjoern]

@benju

One problem might be that I don’t succeed installing the donet40 Winetricks

The howto doesn’t mention dotnet40 and it shouldn’t be necessary for running vvvv anyway I think. For T3 they install dotnetdesktop6, most likely this needs to bedotnetdesktop8 for vvvv.

[bjoern]

Whisky is no longer actively maintained

Maintenance Notice - Whisky Documentation

[readme]

Just linking the Parallels/ARM thread to this one, as this definitely belongs here and is valuable information:
Looks like @u7angel has had success running the regular stable version emulated in Parallels, as well as an actual ARM build which only was waiting for a Stride PR which was merged 2 weeks ago:

feat: Adds native dependencies for win-arm64

It seems @Elias was actively following up on this recently, as more things happened around this. He probably knows when/if there’s some ETA of this :)

[benju]

After the announcement Introducing vvvv on ARM for Windows and Mac – Phase 1/2, and seeing that ARM support is moving forward, I decided to give it another shot to get both the ARM and x64 versions of vvvv gamma running on my MacBook Pro (Apple Silicon).

In addition to the solution with Paralells Desktop as described in the blog post, I was interested to give UTM and VMWare Fusion another try for personal/educational purposes with budget restrictions. Both are available without additional cost.

Another limitation was the need to run it from an external SSD, since my MacBook’s internal drive was too small to install another operating system.

And voilá: I finally have Win11 ARM and vvvv gamma (ARM as well as x64 versions (emulated)) are running sucessfully and quite stable - and also the x64 versions are surprisingly “performant” in VMWare Fusion:

VMware Fusion 13.6.3 running vvvv gammm x64 prerelease 7.0.359 on MacBookPro M1

As expected the vvvv ARM prerelease runs really smooth, but also the x64 stable 6.7 or the x64 prerelease 7.0.359 (unfortunately not the latest 7.0.360).

VMware Fusion is since end of 2024 available without any cost. You can either download the latest version from the official website after registration:

Fusion and Workstation | VMware

Alternatively, you may also obtain it (without registration) from trusted third-party sources such as for example heise.de or chip.de (as e.g.: VMware Fusion - Gratis-Download | Heise)

P.S.: … an what about UTM? I’ve also seen it running at least from 2 persons running Windows ARM and vvvv with UTM, however laggy responsiveness was reported for the x64 versions. I myself did not succeed unfortunately as it always stopped at one point during the installation or Windows Setup process. However it would be also interested to hear from your experiences.

P.P.S.: and of course Paralells Desktop is an option (maybe still the most performant? - comparison would be interesting) if you are using it for commercial purpose - at its cost of course.

P.P.P.S: Skia, Stride, VL.OpenCV, VL.CEF (Skia and Stride) where running quite smooth in my tests. However VL.MediaPipe and VL.Fuse had isses in the gamma x64 versions. VL.MediaPipe does run, but seems to have an issue with the Webserver/WebSocket, so there is no analysis happening.

[benju]

In addition to my post above:
To be honest, getting it running was taking quite a bit (or a bit more :/) of time - with waiting for downloads, unsucessfull image conversions, installation interruptions, many unsucessful tests in UTM, registration processes, different ISOs and whatnot, as well as dealing with freezes and blue screens during installation and setup.
In the end using VMware and a proper Win11-Arm-ISO as well as setting one little checkbox during the installation process where making the difference.

So here are my notes for VMware Fusion, in the hope that you can save yourself the time and enjoy the sunny weather instead ;)

0.) Download VMware Fusion as described above.

1.) I recommend to download an ISO from MS: Windows 11 Arm64 herunterladen instead of using the downloader within VMware installation process as this failed to convert the download to ISO. Also the insider preview - which is an VHDX instead of an ISO - did not work for me (not for VMware nor for UTM).

2.) Setting “UEFI Secure Boot” was the trick – without “UEFI Secure Boot” option, the setup process did not succeed:

3.) To install the Virtual Machine on an external SSD, just select “Customize Settings”

and set the VMware image location to your SSD.

4.) To get vvvv gamma x64 installed/running, you also need to download DotNet runtime 8 (x64): Download .NET 8.0 Desktop Runtime (v8.0.16) - Windows x64 Installer - the vvvv installer will also prompt you to the download anyway.

[chk]

I am wondering why you could now use Stride? I thought that is not supported / integrated yet?